| Author | Message | ||
     Naa_collector Message Board Member Username: Naa_collector Post Number: 6000 Registered: 06-2009  |
Obama flip-flops again, when he thinks he can do so for political gain: http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/white-house-monday-trayvon-case-local-matter/443476 This time he practically claims fathership of slain Florida teen Trayvon--probably hoping to capitalize on racism again for this election. | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3027 Registered: 02-2009  |
"If I had a son he would have looked like Treyvon," I'm interested that none of the pictures shown in this case look like a 17 year old. Knowing from personal experience how quickly nice looking children can change at around 16 into "gang banger" styles of dress and appearance, I'm just suspicious that these particular photos are being circulated for a purpose. Either way based on the photos he's far too pleasant a looking kid for Obama to claim any son of his would look like that  | ||
| Lohman446 Message Board Member Username: Lohman446 Post Number: 1870 Registered: 10-2010 |
I don't care what his son looks like. I assure you his son would not have walked anywhere to buy skittles and an ice tea so this whole "I'm just like you" routine smells. That he talks about knowing what it is for the rest of us while living in all the splendor the taxpayers can put him in is ludicrous and we need to start pointing this out. We will be voting between a rich guy who invested his own money into failing firms and saved some of them and became rich and A guy who has done nothing but take money from others, has never produced a product or created a job, and lives in all the luxury that the taxpayers can afford - or a bit more as he has the gall to ask to raise the debt ceiling while doing it. Do not let this election turn into a class battle. Obama is not like the rest of us who must see a product of our labors in order to make a living. He has lived off others while preaching to know what is best for them. | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3029 Registered: 02-2009 |
+1 Lohman His son would have been in Mexico on an expensive vacation. | ||
| Naa_collector Message Board Member Username: Naa_collector Post Number: 6002 Registered: 06-2009 |
My best guess regarding this case is that somehow Trayvon felt threatened, whether by a REAL threat, or just by being folowed, then he did act somewhat agressively to the neighborhood watch guy--but probably not sufficient to a point that justifies the shooting. It could have been something as simple as turning around and yelling, "Leave me alone!" Hard to say, tho, since we don't have Trayvon's testimony to rely upon. The liberals are trying to use this case to add more gun laws, but I don't think that's going to work. MSNBC even put up a map of the 26 or so states that had similar "Stand your ground" laws and actually said something like, "These are the places you need to feel fear of not being safe." Only if you are the attacker, that is--they didn't add that part., of course. All the big city folk know that in rural areas with guns, all of the gun nuts are out seeking to kill the innocents who don't know that they should have moved to the liberal cities where the government protects them. I don't think many politicians are willing to risk re-election to add more gun control--except that we know Obama doesn't have this problem if he wins again, so who knows? | ||
| Lohman446 Message Board Member Username: Lohman446 Post Number: 1871 Registered: 10-2010 |
IMO Mr. Zimmerman has two big questions to answer (and I asked these in the stories section as well) A) Why, if he was simply foloowing Mr Martin, did he get close enough to result in a physical confrontation. Would following from more than 21 feet away not have been tactically superior and prevented this conflict? B) Why did he disregard police dispatch orders to not follow Mr. Martin? Of course I am also curious how much time elasped between his initial 911 call and police response. | ||
| Naa_collector Message Board Member Username: Naa_collector Post Number: 6003 Registered: 06-2009 |
Yup. Good questions. I think he's screwed. | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3031 Registered: 02-2009 |
We've kinda got this discussion going in more than one place, but again from Fox News, the only place I've seen it stated: "Zimmerman told police Martin attacked him after he had given up on chasing the teenager and was returning to his sport utility vehicle" Now if that is true and can be proven in anyway it puts a whole different take on the situation. It would also explain why the Police took no action at the time. Otherwise, if events transpired as everyone else seems to state, I agree he is screwed. | ||
| Naa_collector Message Board Member Username: Naa_collector Post Number: 6006 Registered: 06-2009 |
Sorry, Redhaawk, that's my bad. This was really a topic on the Florida shooting, when I was thinking it was a new post on Obama flip-flopping. Sorry about that. | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3035 Registered: 02-2009 |
Hey, I wasn't criticizing you Collector, I was apologizing for repeating the Fox News bit again in this thread that I'd posted in the other one. I find it interesting that I'm not reading this anywhere else, as to me this statement from Zimmerman, if true, is crucial to the whole case. | ||
| Louiethelump Message Board Member Username: Louiethelump Post Number: 2783 Registered: 12-2010 |
You guys do know that Sanford is NOT rural, right? It is a suburb of Orlando, and there is nothing rural about Orlando. It is nice to guess about what happened, but your envisioned events do not include how the shooter got his nose bloodied or how he ended up on his back..... Any thoughts on how this attacking armed guy got hit in the face or ended up on the ground on his back while he was "gunning down the poor boy in cold blood" as one news person put it??????? I am not defending him, and he did just about everything wrong, but jumping to conclusions on either side is wrong. Let the crime scene guys and gals put it back together and take it to Grand Jury and see what develops. Just my two cents | ||
| 22man Message Board Member Username: 22man Post Number: 447 Registered: 10-2011 |
+1 !!! What Louie just said. THAT has been my thought on the whole mess. The shooter probably made some mistakes. But did the deceased jump him from around a building corner? maybe shoved him to the ground and started stomping his head? What's sad is all the black activists and now Obama turning this into a race issue,,,,,,, When NOW it has been reported that in addition to being Hispanic, the shooter also has BLACK family members?!?! Obama had the right idea initially with leaving this a local matter, but he felt the political heat from his base so I guess he had to weigh in. They will probably shift focus away from race if Zimmerman does have black family members, and push forward with protesting the 2nd Amendment. | ||
| Lohman446 Message Board Member Username: Lohman446 Post Number: 1873 Registered: 10-2010 |
Actually in another thread we did note that Mr. Zimmerman had evidence of a struggle - such as a broken or bloodied nose and the grass. In that thread I question why he got close enough to someone he was just following. At best a major tactical error. | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3039 Registered: 02-2009 |
Lohman if it's true Zimmerman was attacked by Martin while returning to his SUV, as he claims in his statement to the Police, maybe Zimmerman wasn't the one that controlled how close things got. I still feel the Police had some reason to believe this to be true or they would have taken further action at the time. | ||
| Louiethelump Message Board Member Username: Louiethelump Post Number: 2784 Registered: 12-2010 |
We are still not sure who was yelling for help on the tape. Shooter says it was him, while most people are presuming it was the dead kid. Supposedly they are working on sorting that out. | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3041 Registered: 02-2009 |
That will make a difference too Louie, it will be interesting to see what comes out in all of this. I fear it will take some very compelling evidence to change the minds of some who have already decided what happened. | ||
| Lohman446 Message Board Member Username: Lohman446 Post Number: 1874 Registered: 10-2010 |
I think that the best thing we as supporters of the right to defend oneself can do is to not judge or defend either Mr. Martin or Mr. Zimmerman too strongly at this point. As has been pointed out there is a lot of this story that we do not know. | ||
| 22man Message Board Member Username: 22man Post Number: 455 Registered: 10-2011 |
that sums it up Lohman, it's human nature to speculate and wonder what happened, but to hold either party to OUR view or understanding,,,,,,without all the details is way too premature. The Al Sharptons and Panthers of the world are a minority and will squeeze this event for their GAIN, the media will get their ratings and money off the news as well,,,,,,,but most citizens round me/////black,white,red/////are going about their lives without all the anger portrayed on TV. Judges, Police, Jurors,,,,,THEY are tasked with the burden of figuring out what happened. We, as gun supporters, do well to remain level-headed and focus on the bigger picture----of planning for how Politicians will come at us and our pro-2ndAmendment laws..... | ||
| Westerly1965 Message Board Member Username: Westerly1965 Post Number: 2414 Registered: 09-2010  |
Yea Louie and I had discussed this briefly in a different thread. Bottom line here is the Police didn't make an arrest at the scene. That tells me they believed what he said when he said it. Did the shooter make some mistakes? It sure looks like he did but that doesn't necessarily make him guilty of "gunning someone down in cold blood". At this point we have to wait for the crime scene people to sort out what happened and the grand jury to make a decision on this. Really it is unfair to both the shooter and the kid to jump to any conclusions without the details. This type of thing is always a problem in the media because people tend to theorize without all the facts. When we do this we tend to bend the facts to meet our theories rather than the theories to meet the facts. We must have more FACTS before any conclusions can be drawn. | ||
| 22man Message Board Member Username: 22man Post Number: 471 Registered: 10-2011 |
http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/state/witness-martin-attacked-zimmerman-03232012 Alleged eye witness claims Zimmerman was on his back on the ground being attacked and calling for help. Question has to be considered: since the teenager had a cell phone readily available in his hand, if he felt threatened why did he not call 911? All to be gone over and investigated by paid professionals and then maybe a jury in due process... | ||
| Westerly1965 Message Board Member Username: Westerly1965 Post Number: 2418 Registered: 09-2010 |
Very interesting story there 22man. That is what I mean when I say we don't have enough facts. This guy might have been there and talked to the cops that night. We don't know. And until we do know it is unfair to pass any judgement.. | ||
| Whitehorse Message Board Member Username: Whitehorse Post Number: 884 Registered: 09-2011  |
Anti-Second Amendment Liberal Progressives that bring up the "Stand Your Ground" issue in connection with this case should have their noses rubbed in it inorder to expose their anti-Constitutional agendas. | ||
| Heyjoe Message Board Member Username: Heyjoe Post Number: 2663 Registered: 02-2009  |
can you please elaborate on how that could be accomplished? | ||
| Redhawk4 Message Board Member Username: Redhawk4 Post Number: 3049 Registered: 02-2009 |
Wow this one keeps on running, the more info that comes out the more it looks like the Police took the appropriate action in the first place. If this independent witness is for real this really changes things. Unfortunately, it's now got to the point where too many African Americans will never be satisfied with any outcome that doesn't paint Zimmerman as guilty. Obama might have dug himself a hole yet by saying if he had a son he'd be like Martin. | ||
| Louiethelump Message Board Member Username: Louiethelump Post Number: 2787 Registered: 12-2010 |
They just convicted the 17 year old that murdered the St.Pete police officer last year and gave him life. He said he did it. His lawyer said he did it. The black community is outraged that such a thing was not called manslaughter. They admit he did it too. You are not going to win these days, and the more you cater to the likes of Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and the mob mentality, the worse it gets. We have big trouble coming in this country. | ||
| Naa_collector Message Board Member Username: Naa_collector Post Number: 6035 Registered: 06-2009 |
It doesn't matter what the truth is any more, Redhawk. This case is beyond that now. Many African Americans believe this an issue of principal now and it's no longer really about what happened. A young black kid is dead and somebody has to pay, regardless of whose fault it really was. This is beyond what really happened in the five-minute skirmish. Just like the etch-a-sketch thing, this will balloon even further. It's like a train out of control and I have no idea where it's headed. And, btw, I can't believe I called his thread "flip-flips". Oops. |
